Embracing Unity in Faith

0:00:00 – (Steve Gray): Well, do you like hearing secrets? I don’t know. I’m not sure I like secrets. But on the next podcast, I’ll tell you a secret about the kingdom of God that could change your life forever. Like right now.

0:00:11 – (Steve Gray): Today, you were made for more than the status quo. I’m Pastor Steve Gray, and this is the More Faith, More Life podcast. This podcast is for Christians with an ambitious heart who want to be more for their family, do more with their career, and see more of God’s promises in their life. I’ve spent many years as a worship artist, minister, nonprofit leader, bold truth speaker, and most importantly, father and spouse. When I was in my early 40s, I was craving more.

0:00:40 – (Steve Gray): More from God and more from life. I’d done everything I was supposed to do. My life was good, but it wasn’t good enough. So I spent the following years diving into the word of God and searching for the biblical principles that would bring me closer to God and help my purpose and life flourish. That’s what I want to share with you. In every episode, you’ll get practical tools based on real life experiences that you can put into action to redefine your faith and ultimately your life.

0:01:11 – (Steve Gray): So if you’re ready to do more, subscribe to More Faith, More Life and hear an unfiltered biblical truth every week. It’s time to be and experience more.

0:01:22 – (Steve Gray): Hello and welcome to another More Faith, More Life podcast. I’ve got my wife Kathy with me again today and we’re going to talk about some great things and I’m so glad you’re with us. I hope you’re telling friends about this podcast and if you’ve been following it, I’m hoping you pick up the jewels that we try to bring to you, the value, the pearl of great price jewels, you know, of how valuable the kingdom of God is, how valuable Jesus is, and if you’ll really put your faith in this system of God that you will get more life out of it. And I’m not talking about eternal life.

0:01:56 – (Steve Gray): I’m talking about right now, life. And so many people, Kathy. Life. You hear the phrases passing them by, you know, or two ships in the night or something like that. I’m on a slow boat to China. I don’t know all those phrases people talk about, but life does pass them by. And, you know, we’re blessed to have just celebrated 50 years of marriage. But if you try to remember it all, like, where did it all go?

0:02:21 – (Steve Gray): Some of it’s a blur or something. I can’t remember. And so you wanna get the life God has. And Jesus said he came and we have more life than people who don’t know him. Basically, you’re able to pull life out of the smallest situations. Right. Wouldn’t it be great if everybody listening could pull life out of watching a cartoon with their kid instead of sitting there waiting till the cartoon’s over so you can go do something else that you wanna do, but you’re pulling life out of that moment.

0:02:52 – (Steve Gray): And, you know, I was thinking about this yesterday, how I’ve been able through the years to just get into people’s lives and become a real influence. And you know. Cause you watch when I’m with that person, I’m pulling life out of that moment. I’m not talking to them saying, I’m only talking to you. Especially kids and grandkids. Kids and grandkids, they notice the difference. And they’re around people all the time, aren’t they, Kathy?

0:03:23 – (Steve Gray): School or whatever. Friends or whatever. But if you get the ability, if you let your faith mold you in your character, you’ll be able to pull life out of the smallest situations. And they may not even know what’s going on. And to you, you’re just sitting, watching a cartoon or something with a kid, they know it is an invisible pull on their heart because they’re getting more life out of sitting with you than they would have gotten sitting alone.

0:03:55 – (Steve Gray): Isn’t that powerful?

0:03:56 – (Kathy Gray): What a great way to live. Gives you purpose for your life. And you’re a. You’re a wonderful grandpa. And you know, you do. You tried that so much. But with all of our congregation, everyone you meet, even now, you’ve broken out of your. Your. What is it called? You used to be afraid to talk to people at the grocery store.

0:04:17 – (Steve Gray): I was in a shell.

0:04:19 – (Kathy Gray): You get. You’ve gotten out of your shell now. And I’ve been noticing how your purposely, when we’re out and about, you’re. You’re giving life to the people around you. And they respond.

0:04:31 – (Steve Gray): Yeah, I strategize. I see. I notice, you know, and what. Who can I talk to or who can I leave alone? Doesn’t need anybody to talk to them. Yeah. Because sometimes that would be just as bad.

0:04:40 – (Kathy Gray): Exactly. Leave me alone, buddy.

0:04:42 – (Steve Gray): Yeah, right.

0:04:43 – (Kathy Gray): But you know, Steve, I’ve been so enjoying your book. Mighty like Gideon. Yeah. Revived and battle ready at your river of testing. And it’s of so many principles that you’ve taught me over the years and that you taught to our church. And it’s just challenging. And for me, even to keep Reading it. But I’ve got some questions for you today that kind of make you tick, that you see the purpose and principle in there. But I got a question.

0:05:11 – (Kathy Gray): So you often talk about how the enemy actually works through certain kinds of systems, like in our government, of course, in economics, but also in the church itself, some kinds of systems. And it lets the enemy in. And I wonder if you’d let us know how this happens and what you’re thinking about it.

0:05:33 – (Steve Gray): Well, first of all, I can tell you there’s one strong, strong principle that hardly in all of my preaching years and travels and around the world and churches, churches, churches, and our church, people don’t know, and they’re blinded to it. And so let me something to you, okay? Here’s a scripture that we know, and I hope the people know we have it right here. Ephesians 6:12, right? You want read Ephesians 6:12?

0:06:00 – (Kathy Gray): All righty.

0:06:01 – (Steve Gray): I’m going to listen to every word and I’m going to tell you about it.

0:06:03 – (Kathy Gray): For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world, and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.

0:06:19 – (Steve Gray): Now, you often. And other people often, they try to get me to talk and share because you often say, why didn’t I see that? Or how come I. So you want to have another. Why didn’t I see that moment?

0:06:30 – (Kathy Gray): I’m ready for one.

0:06:31 – (Steve Gray): All right. In that scripture is a key that you very seldom will see anybody ever mention or even see or even understand. Okay. First of all, that is take what that scripture’s about. I don’t know why I’m looking at the scripture. I already know the scripture. I’ll look at you instead. And you. Okay, so the scripture we know is what’s typically a warfare, spiritual warfare scripture. Right. And so it’s very important that we have spiritual warfare or we’re gonna be overtaken.

0:07:02 – (Steve Gray): We could be overtaken. All right. The key in that scripture, almost everybody misses. Okay, watch these words and see the system. Cause you mentioned systems, right?

0:07:13 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah.

0:07:14 – (Steve Gray): The first system they’re gonna miss is the first two words for our. There’s the key. And almost 100% of the people will miss that. They’re gonna try to apply that scripture to. For my. Instead of for our. You can imagine God being in this for himself or Jesus being in this for himself or Paul being in, but we can imagine some of these people being in. So the first key is our. Our struggle. Okay. And when we talk about then who Our struggle’s against.

0:07:51 – (Steve Gray): Look at the. Watch this revelation. Read it now.

0:07:54 – (Kathy Gray): Okay. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood.

0:07:58 – (Steve Gray): Now keep reading.

0:07:59 – (Kathy Gray): But against the rulers. Okay. Against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world. And against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.

0:08:15 – (Steve Gray): Okay, so now those two. I brought up two points. The first two words for our. Right. What does for our. And what you just read. Because one is hour. But the others, the spiritual forces, powers of darkness. What in that scripture is revealed to us that we have in common with the principalities of power. Notice something? Everything’s plural. Our struggle. But they’re not alone. And they’re not trying to do it alone. And the devil doesn’t do it alone.

0:08:51 – (Steve Gray): The spiritual power, the wickedness in high. Every one of those is rulers, authorities, powers. It’s all plural, right?

0:09:01 – (Kathy Gray): Yes.

0:09:02 – (Steve Gray): So imagine trying to defeat the devil or those powers as an individual. When it’s our struggle and we need a group to defeat that group. We’re against a group here. And the Devil was smart enough when he was cast out of heaven. And he set up who he’s gonna be and what he’s gonna do. A lot of evil stuff. What’d he do? He got a group. When he left heaven. He took a group. He’s got a group. And almost everybody will fail in spiritual warfare.

0:09:37 – (Steve Gray): Not totally, because, you know, you got God’s grace, God’s mercy, our faith. Okay, there’s pieces, pieces. But I’m talking about a consistent lifetime of beating principalities and powers up and getting them out and getting more life out of. By your faith walk. And most people will never be able to do it because they’re trying to do it as an individual. And they’re trying to defeat a group as an individual.

0:10:04 – (Steve Gray): And in the book. In the book. So, Gideon, you’re gonna defeat the Midianites. So God had to work on his character. He had to tear down his father’s. There’s a whole lot going. But as you get closer and closer to the. We call it a battle without swords. They didn’t have. But you get closer to the defeat of the Midianites. What’s God do? Okay, Gideon, next thing we gotta do is get you a group. Gotta get you a group.

0:10:33 – (Steve Gray): And you gotta learn to work with a group. And we’re gonna get a group that knows how to work together. And you tell the group just to do what you say. Do what you do. Get Gideon. I’ll tell you what to do then. I’m not gonna tell them what to do though, right? How many people? When God tells me, sorry, some of you, you’re not on speaking terms anymore, but God was speaking to Gideon. So all you had to do was get in the group. If you wanted to defeat the Midianites, all you had to do was get in that group.

0:11:07 – (Steve Gray): Now they only had 300, so. And that’s part of the story, defeating out of 300. But it doesn’t matter, right?

0:11:14 – (Kathy Gray): Right.

0:11:14 – (Steve Gray): If you want to defeat Kathy, if you want to defeat the Midianites, all you gotta do is get in that group. Cause God’s already ordained that they’re gonna lose. He’s already ordained. If you follow the group, do what the group does, the leader says the group does, you’ll be a winner. Even if you’re not a winner individually, if you’ve never fought a battle, you say, well, I’m kind of weak in faith. Well, get in a group with lots of faith, Amen.

0:11:42 – (Steve Gray): And you’ll start winning.

0:11:43 – (Kathy Gray): I agree.

0:11:44 – (Steve Gray): So the deception is individualism. Trying to defeat the devil who’s in a group by being an individual outside of a group. And so people, yeah, those spiritual forces.

0:11:56 – (Kathy Gray): Are smarter than we are.

0:11:58 – (Steve Gray): And they work together.

0:11:59 – (Kathy Gray): And they work together. I mean, they’re smarter because they work together and they stay in a group or a pack or a herd or a flock or whatever, but they’re actually smarter than us human beings.

0:12:13 – (Steve Gray): And of course we have such a prideful egotistical culture anyway, so we think we can do it. And we read the Bible as an individual and we read all the promises as an individual. And that’s just a great example of the thousands and thousands and thousands of people that you and I have heard quote that scripture in all these years, who they’re saying our. But they’re going to try to do it. Me, I’m going to try to do it myself.

0:12:37 – (Steve Gray): And they don’t have the power of the group. And I get it, you know, I get it. People are suspicious of groups. They’re afraid that they’re going to get a group leader that turns out to be a one eyed pirate or something with a sword that’s going to, you know, make them walk the plane. Yeah, well that works too. But you know, if I get in this group, who knows if the captain is not going to make me walk the plank, you know, and so I’m just gonna be safe and not get in a group.

0:13:03 – (Steve Gray): You know, there’s problems everywhere, there’s groups everywhere with problems. But finally there comes a time when we as believers, we have to get in the group. And that’s where your character is developed, is within a group. Individuals don’t have to have character. Cause nobody likes you anyway. Cause you’re never with anybody. You just do your own thing. You know, you got friends, but you’re an individual among friends.

0:13:29 – (Steve Gray): Right. Instead of activating this power of the word of God, which is for the body of Christ, the group of God, the church, all the terms we use, you know, the bride of Christ, the church, the group, the congregation, whatever, it’s for the group. So everything is group. And if you don’t think group, but you stay in the visual realm, will you get any victories? Of course you’ll get. But not the victory, which is the frustration of many believers today. Not the victory you could have, not the victory you’d like to have, and not the victory you’re supposed to have.

0:14:07 – (Steve Gray): It might be, you get some victories, God loves you. You know, God’s going to help you. We all know that. But if you’re bucking the system, you’re trying to be the individual that can take on the kingdom of darkness. And so you gotta get in the right group and you gotta stop being afraid of a group. And really, you better. In my opinion, you better stop being afraid of a leader. Yes, they’re gonna be imperfect.

0:14:33 – (Steve Gray): You know, today, in our world today, we got a lot of chatter about what’s going on in certain churches and denominations and trouble. And people fall and they rise and they fall. And during this last couple years, I had people that try to ask me my opinion of that. And some of them are just devastated, you know, by that. I can’t believe that, Pastor. What? That ministry. And I go, what are you talking about?

0:14:58 – (Steve Gray): Nothing’s changed. This has always happened. Yes. And you read your Bible, you’ll have, like in the three books of John, first, second, third, John. They’re struggling with a lot of people. And he’s saying, be careful of those people. Stay away from those people. One of the scriptures, look out for the dogs. Well, look out. There’s wolves and sheep’s clothing. Look out for the. Yeah, it’s always been that way.

0:15:24 – (Steve Gray): It has nothing to do, Kathy, that things are gearing up for the end of the world. Because look at all the ministers or churches that are struggling or falling or whatever. It’s always been here. You deal with it. You look. Don’t look. Don’t look to the power of man. But you might have to look to a man or a woman if they’re in the power of God. And God puts them, makes them a Gideon, then you’re either gonna get to be in the 300 or if you can’t follow Gideon and you don’t trust Gideon and you don’t think it’s fair that Gideon, who says he’s weak and a nobody, well, you don’t think it’s fair, well, just enjoy yourself and go with the rest of the cowards. Cause 9,700 men didn’t get to do it.

0:16:07 – (Steve Gray): And you know what? They were just as capable, except in one area. They couldn’t follow a man, they couldn’t take directions, and they couldn’t be told what to do. And so God got those out of the way and got 300 guys that could just do. Just do what we tell you to do. Not me, but what the Bible says, what your leaders say, what God’s in for, and get in on it. Now, do we need to. Do we need as individuals, Kathy, to read our Bible as an individual?

0:16:37 – (Kathy Gray): Correct.

0:16:38 – (Steve Gray): Because that’s our safety. That’s when you’ll be able to see.

0:16:42 – (Kathy Gray): Yes.

0:16:42 – (Steve Gray): Oh, that’s not right. Or this is getting off, or this is making me nervous. Or people say, today, you know, I saw a red flag, or I think there was a red flag. You know, I felt a red flag. You know, that means suspicion or something like that. But. But people read their Bible as an individual and then pay attention to what it says. That’s what right. How is it possible that an individual could read their Bible and then get angry by coming to. We’ll just use our church, Revive church.

0:17:14 – (Steve Gray): Because people raise their hands or they’re upset because it’s a church that believes in speaking in tongues. So they hate us. What you hate. Okay, where did you get that Scripture or tongues? I mentioned this. You know, they say tongues is of the devil. Where did you read that, Mr. Individual, Mrs. Individual. Ms. Individual. Where did you read that or did you read. I wish you all would speak in tongues, but I wish you all would really prophesy.

0:17:47 – (Steve Gray): Why? Because we’re going to help some people. We do it. Cause I want you to help people. So do it this way. If you do it the other way or any other way or not at all, you’re not going to be able to help as many people. So the individual. It’s individualism that’s wrecking the ability to fully experience the power and presence of God today. Because even our leaders are individuals. You know, they don’t feel the group.

0:18:13 – (Steve Gray): Oh, it’s terrible. Even in Kansas City or any city, it’s so horrible. If you want to fellowship with other leaders and pastors and that you can’t hardly even find. If you’re not part of their denomination, they don’t have anything to do with you. Or they divide it up like. Well, don’t know. Steve Gray, you know him and you read his book. He believes in miracles today and the power of God. Or he preaches. He preaches right to the people that are right in front of him. He doesn’t play seeker sensitive. So don’t go to his church or don’t, you know, what are you talking about? Where.

0:18:45 – (Steve Gray): See, so individuals are reading their Bible, but they’re not doing it and they’re not accepting what it says. Cause I could go into 100 churches and read something that says to do. Oh yeah, let’s try this. I could go to 100 churches, read the scripture, bow down and worship him. Or let’s bow. Let’s all bow down or whatever, you know, or they bowed down. Or when we all get to heaven or whatever, we’re going to cast our crowns and bow.

0:19:10 – (Steve Gray): Anything like that. All right, now let’s do it. There are not only people that won’t do it, there are people that can’t. They can’t. It’s not that they have a problem with me. They cannot do group stuff. They can’t do it. And so they just stand there. I mean, how many worship leaders could be listening right now that said, let’s all lift our hands and sing Psalm number 21. And you look out there and what, 10 people, their hands up and the rest of people standing?

0:19:40 – (Steve Gray): They can’t. They’re too individualistic to follow the directions of somebody else. But what do you think the Bible is? The Bible is a book of directions that’s coming from somebody else who is Jesus, King of all kings. Even a minor king has to follow that king. Gotta listen, whoever you are. So the problem where most people are gonna miss it is, yeah, we have an enemy, principalities and powers. And our struggle is with them.

0:20:11 – (Steve Gray): But it’s our struggle. And if you ain’t got an hour o u r, you’re not part of our. Then it’s not our struggle. Have fun. You’re on your own. You’re on your own and you’re gonna try to defeat a group by yourself. So, Gideon. All right, Gideon, I’ll tell you what. Since nobody will follow you and you’re going, all right, go out, I’ll give you. Take your jar and your trumpet and see if you can go get the Midianites. Cause after all, I’m with you. The Lord is with you. You should be able to pull this off by yourself.

0:20:40 – (Steve Gray): But God said, nope, I’m going to get you 300. 300 that are part of a group. And it’s the group of 300. And that group defeated the Midianites, who had been torturing them, tormenting them for seven years. But in the blink of an eye, God got them. But he had a special way of doing it. So that’s my talk. And we didn’t know what we were going to talk about today. Wonderful. It’s pretty good stuff. And it’s such a.

0:21:07 – (Steve Gray): And it should be really convicting of how terrible people are of thinking for a group. You know, me, I’m a group thinker. We’ll be done with this today, the podcast. And I’ll get up all of a sudden, I’ll start saying, okay, here’s what we’re gonna do, group. We’re gonna do this, and you gotta get over to there and you, you know, I think for the group. And it’s a joy to be part of group.

0:21:28 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah. To be part of a group.

0:21:29 – (Steve Gray): And that’s where we’re part of the body of Christ. We’re part of a group. And the group worked for Gideon and the group will work for you. I hope you’ll get that book. And first of all, I hope that really means just soak in that. Soak in it. And when you read your Bible, think, everybody’s reading this, not just me, we’re all reading this. This is for all of us. It’ll work for anybody, but it’s for all of us. Read it like you’re in a group, even if you’re home by yourself.

0:21:54 – (Steve Gray): All right, so we’re hoping to change your life. This book will do it. You can get the book, you know, but you can get something special. You go to stevegreyministries.com I think you can go to morefaithmorelife.com and you not only can get the book mighty like Gideon, for like $1 or something like that, you can get this great workbook that’s. It’s just outstanding. And I think so that’s why you can get the book in bookstores and online and all that, but you can’t get this study guide any place but right here. So if you want to get that study guide, do that. It’s been a pleasure talking with you, Kathy, today, and all these people and trying to get these things out. That’s going to change your life. Forever.

0:22:32 – (Steve Gray): You more faith and you get more life. Till next time. Bye.