Passing the Spiritual Mantle

0:00:03 – (Kathy Gray): Hello, everyone. Welcome to More Faith, More Life. You know, the more faith that you grow in, the more God kind of life you’re going to receive.

0:00:13 – (Steve Gray): You were made for more than the status quo. I’m Pastor Steve Gray, and this is the More Faith, More Life podcast. This podcast is for Christians with an ambitious heart who want to be more for their family, do more with their career, and see more of God’s promises in their life. I’ve spent many years as a worship artist, minister, non-profit leader, bold truth speaker, and most importantly, father and spouse.

0:00:38 – (Steve Gray): When I was in my early 40s, I was craving more, more from God and more from life. I’d done everything I was supposed to do. My life was good, but it wasn’t good enough. So I spent the following years diving into the word of God and searching for the biblical principles that would bring me closer to God and help my purpose and life flourish. That’s what I want to share with you. In every episode, you’ll get practical tools based on real life experiences that you can put into action to redefine your faith and ultimately your life.

0:01:12 – (Steve Gray): So if you’re ready to do more, subscribe to More Faith, More Life and hear an unfiltered biblical truth every week. It’s time to be and experience more.

0:01:23 – (Kathy Gray): So I’m Kathy Gray and I am filling in for my husband, Steve Gray. So, you know, you can always go online and watch all the other ones or wait till next week. Oh, no. But I think you’re going to enjoy yourself today because I have with me my really dear friend Heather Eschenbaum, and she’s going to be sharing with me today. And how long have we been growing together in the Lord?

0:01:49 – (Heather Eschenbaum): It has been 27 years.

0:01:51 – (Kathy Gray): Isn’t that something else?

0:01:52 – (Heather Eschenbaum): It is. I don’t even think it could be that long. I’m so impressed with what God has done and I’m so amazed. And I’m so thankful.

0:02:00 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah. And I’m so thankful for you and for the camaraderie that we have together. You know, I think it is kind of a once in a lifetime gift to have one other person in your life besides your spouse, but that you can flow with and minister with. But you know what else? I have a lot of fun with you.

0:02:21 – (Heather Eschenbaum): I know we do. We really do. I know we do.

0:02:24 – (Kathy Gray): And you know, you’ve got such a sense of humor when you minister. You’re like, everyone’s going. And then you bring in. So you’re a farm girl, you grew up on the farm, so you bring in some of Your farm examples. And it kind of is still piercing, but it helps us relax a minute.

0:02:42 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right. She’s just a farm girl. What can she really do?

0:02:46 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah.

0:02:47 – (Heather Eschenbaum): How anointed could she be? How could she be?

0:02:49 – (Kathy Gray): And, you know, you’ve given the examples of kind of working with your dad in the fields and all that stuff that you’ve really applied. But one of the things I really remember is you had to help take care of the pigs.

0:03:02 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Oh, yes, yes. So we have. We had 60 sows, which is the female mama, and 60 sows. And we had 400 baby pigs a year.

0:03:14 – (Kathy Gray): 400.

0:03:15 – (Heather Eschenbaum): 400 baby pigs a year.

0:03:17 – (Kathy Gray): Okay. And what did you do?

0:03:20 – (Heather Eschenbaum): So I took care of them in every single way. We sorted them when it was time for market, but obviously they were born a long time before that. Fed them, make sure that they were taken care of in the summer because they would get too hot. Pigs don’t have sweat glands. And so I’d have to go out every summer with a garden hose and have to make sure and make the floors muddy for them. And I’d have to do it one hour and then wait an hour and then go out the next hour and wait an hour because it would dry.

0:03:51 – (Kathy Gray): Oh, my.

0:03:52 – (Heather Eschenbaum): So all day I smelled like pigs.

0:03:55 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah.

0:03:56 – (Heather Eschenbaum): All day long. My mom wouldn’t even let me in the house. She’d be like, you can’t come in. Or at least set down a towel.

0:04:00 – (Kathy Gray): Wow.

0:04:01 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And then they would shake their heads because the. The water, they get in the way, and I’d just be covered in heather. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

0:04:09 – (Kathy Gray): But you wash the pigs, so. Boy, I could think of a sermon using that.

0:04:13 – (Heather Eschenbaum): I know, I know, I know.

0:04:15 – (Kathy Gray): You know, wash. We’re being washed with the water of the word because we’re. Well, we’re sheep.

0:04:21 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right, right. Thankfully. Thankfully.

0:04:24 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah. We don’t want to be called pigs. Pigs.

0:04:27 – (Heather Eschenbaum): What story did you just say?

0:04:31 – (Kathy Gray): Oh, dear. Yeah. Run piggies. Run down the hill into the water.

0:04:35 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes. It was a great way to grow. I have a lot of character. Farm girls, farm guys, they all have a lot of character.

0:04:43 – (Kathy Gray): It’s true.

0:04:43 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Because they’re almost more ready for ministry, because they don’t think in terms of time, they think in terms of accomplishments. And so I don’t think ever nine to five, I think in terms of helping. And animals don’t care what time it is. They don’t care if you’re sick. And so it builds character to take care of something so much. And then we had 500 head of cattle, so. Yes. So we had Them as well, and calves. And then we had about 1500 acres.

0:05:15 – (Kathy Gray): You were a busy little farmhand.

0:05:17 – (Heather Eschenbaum): I know. And I had no brothers. It was just my mom and dad and my sister and me. Wow.

0:05:23 – (Kathy Gray): That’s no wonder. You have such character.

0:05:26 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes. You can stick me on a farm. I could do almost anything.

0:05:29 – (Kathy Gray): You could do it. You could do it. Well, I’m just so proud of everything. Everything you can do. But, you know, today we want to talk a little bit about the mantle. And the mantle is the anointing of the Holy Spirit, and it covers you, and you and I both. It can grow and it can be added to and made more beautiful. And we’ve got something that we taught together a lot of years, didn’t we, in our faith class about a great prophet named.

0:05:59 – (Heather Eschenbaum): We had Elisha and Elijah that we talked about. I always remember you said, now remember, alphabetically, you can remember which one comes first. So there’s Elijah and then Elisha.

0:06:11 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah. There’s the sh. Elisha.

0:06:14 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:06:14 – (Kathy Gray): I’m learning that with my little granddaughter. Well, she’s learning it. Oh, yeah. And now all day yesterday, she would say things like, I want some cake.

0:06:24 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Cake.

0:06:25 – (Kathy Gray): That’s a C. You know, Elijah. And then Elisha.

0:06:30 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:06:30 – (Kathy Gray): So tell me a little bit about their story and how did they get together?

0:06:34 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes. Well, I really love this story. And it’s interesting. We talked about farming, too, because there was Elisha doing the work, and he was taking care of the land. He was taking care of things. And I love how then here comes Elijah and he. Even in the Word. And you shared this, too, in classes where he passed by the School of Prophets.

0:07:00 – (Kathy Gray): Right.

0:07:01 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And they were there studying and learning and growing and doing all this. And then he sees someone farming. And even though this young man didn’t feel probably qualified.

0:07:16 – (Kathy Gray): Right.

0:07:16 – (Heather Eschenbaum): He wasn’t here over at the School of Ministry getting things done spiritually.

0:07:20 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah.

0:07:21 – (Heather Eschenbaum): But here comes Elijah and sees Elisha and says, let’s go. Let’s go. Throws that mantle on him. And what would that feel like, you know? I know what feels like to really work hard in the dirt and the smells and the things. And then to have someone walk up and say, here’s that mantle. And it didn’t. It had to have felt like something.

0:07:46 – (Kathy Gray): Oh, that weightiness.

0:07:48 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:07:48 – (Kathy Gray): It was made out of animal skins, wasn’t it?

0:07:51 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes. Yes.

0:07:52 – (Kathy Gray): And, you know, I like to remind our students that that mantle was not a fancy coat, you know, on a. A hoity Toity type, you know, making him look like. I don’t Know, a mafia guy in his trench coat. That. That’s my husband’s influence right there. But the mantle, then, he was like a nomad. He was a. Elijah was a desert dweller, and he an itinerant type prophet. And those mantles made out of the animal skin, they were weathered.

0:08:24 – (Kathy Gray): They. They smelled.

0:08:26 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right.

0:08:26 – (Kathy Gray): Honestly, they smelled. And he had one mantle. And so how often do you get men to change their clothes?

0:08:35 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right.

0:08:36 – (Kathy Gray): You know, unless, you know, unless, like my husband and your husband.

0:08:40 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right, right.

0:08:40 – (Kathy Gray): They’re very orderly.

0:08:42 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:08:42 – (Kathy Gray): Changing, putting on clean clothes.

0:08:44 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Thank goodness.

0:08:45 – (Kathy Gray): Thank goodness.

0:08:46 – (Heather Eschenbaum): They smell nice as well.

0:08:47 – (Kathy Gray): They do. They do. But, you know that mantle, then on Elijah.

0:08:52 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right.

0:08:52 – (Kathy Gray): Smelled like the desert was dirty.

0:08:55 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:08:56 – (Kathy Gray): It was laden with miles and miles of walking and prophesying, and it was just covered like that, not only with the natural elements, but then, you know, I think sometimes in ministry, there’s a good fragrance that goes up to God. But remember, Paul said, to those who are being saved, it smells like life. But to those who are not being saved, you know, it smells.

0:09:24 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right.

0:09:25 – (Kathy Gray): It stinks, that mantle.

0:09:27 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:09:27 – (Kathy Gray): And so he threw it on Elisha, the young guy.

0:09:32 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:09:32 – (Kathy Gray): And. And how do you think then you were saying, wow. He felt. He felt the weightiness of that glory and that anointing, that ability.

0:09:42 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:09:42 – (Kathy Gray): And you know what, though? He got to feel it. What happened?

0:09:47 – (Heather Eschenbaum): He was able to respond.

0:09:49 – (Kathy Gray): Yes, he was. And he took it. But then Elijah took it right back off of him for 10 years.

0:09:57 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Exactly.

0:09:58 – (Kathy Gray): So he had a taste of it. He had a hunger put into him for that anointing and that ability for the prophetic and speaking up for God. But the mantle was taken back and put on, and Elijah took back his mantle that he had grown for a lot of years, but Elisha never forgot it.

0:10:19 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Never.

0:10:19 – (Kathy Gray): But then he decided to serve Elijah.

0:10:22 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Exactly.

0:10:22 – (Kathy Gray): And he went with him as a servant.

0:10:25 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes. Which is so powerful.

0:10:27 – (Kathy Gray): So powerful.

0:10:28 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And, you know, that’s so good because we think, well, the mantle’s here. I need to run a worldwide ministry.

0:10:35 – (Kathy Gray): Yep.

0:10:36 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And it’s so impactful to say he then learned for 10 years. And he didn’t just learn. He served for 10 years. And I’m so thankful that as zealous as I was younger, thinking I should just be and do everything. No, I really wanted to serve.

0:10:54 – (Kathy Gray): Yes.

0:10:54 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And I really wanted to learn. And I think that my mantle and your. Everyone’s.

0:10:59 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah.

0:11:00 – (Heather Eschenbaum): It grows out of service so much more.

0:11:03 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah.

0:11:04 – (Heather Eschenbaum): It’s. It’s like. And I. I knew when I walked in to our church and I Saw, like I saw the mantle of God. I saw the mantle of God, and I saw. This is where prophecy is activated. This is where opportunities come alive. This is where I can become who God has said I can be. And I for myself, my mantle, I love it, too. You taught about how it might start out small and you feel like it’s insignificant. It’s not.

0:11:36 – (Heather Eschenbaum): But it can grow. Yes. And being under. Under the leadership of our church, being a servant to you and others, I felt my. My growth because I keep giving. And that was something you were saying, too, that giving is a growth and.

0:11:54 – (Kathy Gray): The giving of yourself to the Holy Spirit. Because the mantle is the anointing. Yes, the mantle is the anointing, the power and presence of God. And so Elijah knew that mantle represented God’s mercy to him. You know, God’s calling.

0:12:13 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right.

0:12:14 – (Kathy Gray): God’s empowering. God’s authorizing him and filling him with words that bubbled up, you know. You know, you gotta have a mantle before you go to a king.

0:12:27 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right.

0:12:27 – (Kathy Gray): You’ve got to have the Holy Spirit backing you up. And you know so many people. Well, even, you know, people you and I have known for a lot of years, and they get around the anointing in our church, and then they think it’s their anointing.

0:12:43 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right.

0:12:43 – (Kathy Gray): Have you. You’ve seen that, haven’t you?

0:12:45 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Oh, I’ve seen it. I’ve seen it every year. Every year. And I know we. We have a corporate anointing.

0:12:52 – (Kathy Gray): Yes, we do.

0:12:52 – (Heather Eschenbaum): We have a very strong corporate anointing, and we have a leadership anointing as well. And there is a mantle that is on Pastor Steve that is so unique. There’s a unique ability there for him to speak to God and speak to God for us. And I look at that and. And I watch. And we think, too. We’re like, well, it’s so easy in our atmosphere to prophesy. It’s so easy to pray and sing and do. But there’s a. There’s an anointing and there’s an ability of that mantle.

0:13:30 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And when you decide, I’m just going to go out and try everything on my own and I’m just going to start a church over here. It is so much harder than we can comprehend. And for me, I’ve wanted to stay. I want to stay under the mantle. I want to stay with the people. I want to continue because there’s so much ministry to do in our church.

0:13:53 – (Kathy Gray): Yes.

0:13:54 – (Heather Eschenbaum): You don’t have to go out to find more.

0:13:56 – (Kathy Gray): No, you do not. You don’t and again, you. Many people have come to us over the years and they’ve said, we have such a mantle, we have such an anointing. We are so called of God, and we don’t want to be held back anymore. We’ve decided we’ve taken a tiny little church somewhere or we’re going on the road as evangelists and, you know, we’re going to go here and there. And when they tell us they’ve already decided and they’ve already bought their little travel van.

0:14:27 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right.

0:14:27 – (Kathy Gray): And everything, what can we say?

0:14:30 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Nothing you can do. There’s nothing you can do. No, no.

0:14:34 – (Kathy Gray): And, you know, I try to guard my face. People tell us that because they, they feel that. They feel that anointing in the corporate setting, it’s the truth. And you know, and it does. It is. Our church is the easiest place to minister.

0:14:50 – (Heather Eschenbaum): It is.

0:14:51 – (Kathy Gray): Don’t you think?

0:14:51 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Oh, 100%. We’ve had so many visitors, speakers, visiting speakers. And as they speak and worship and lead, they are just blown away because the road is easy. We paved the way for the Holy Spirit to move, and our people are responsive and open. And that’s not the case in very many places.

0:15:15 – (Kathy Gray): No, it isn’t.

0:15:16 – (Heather Eschenbaum): It’s not.

0:15:16 – (Kathy Gray): And so that can build up someone’s immaturity.

0:15:20 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes, yes.

0:15:21 – (Kathy Gray): And, you know, we give opportunities to people and they’re not. You know, we give opportunities to people to move under that corporate anointing. And then they don’t understand sometimes you’re ministering not because you have a mantle, which they all do, but it is because of that presence and that faith among all the people. And our church really is the easiest, I think, on the face of the earth.

0:15:48 – (Heather Eschenbaum): I do, too. I do, too. And I’ve been to a lot of places and I had the chance to go and, and, and minister at different places, visiting. And there’s nothing like our group and our, our building. And I, you know, you’re watching and you’ve got a great church to remember. It’s hard to step out on your own. And, and if I can even. I encourage you to not use the God card.

0:16:14 – (Kathy Gray): Amen.

0:16:15 – (Heather Eschenbaum): I encourage you to stop using that God card. You know, God speaks to all of us, but also he speaks to your leaders and people around you. And sometimes when you say, well, we’re just going to go do this and this is how it’s going to be, and then people don’t agree. We say, oh, but this card, I’ve got this card. God said to do it. God said to do it. And, and sometimes we need to humble ourselves and just make sure.

0:16:44 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Talk with your leaders, talk with your pastors. Don’t tell them. Go and talk to people of ownership of the mantle that you’re asking God to give you.

0:16:56 – (Kathy Gray): Yes, that’s so good. And you know, the mantle can grow.

0:17:00 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:17:01 – (Kathy Gray): But you got to hang around. Yes, you’ve got to hang around it. And just like with Elisha, he hung around with Elijah, you know, and all of some of the rough stuff that Elijah then endured for 10 years, Elisha was right there and he was growing in character and hunger and in faith.

0:17:20 – (Heather Eschenbaum): It’s so true.

0:17:21 – (Kathy Gray): You know, they had so many faith adventures which were very rugged.

0:17:24 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes, yes.

0:17:26 – (Kathy Gray): You know, they were rugged. They were not ego building or ego stroking, you know, and there were lonely times, there were hard times and, and rough times and persecution times during those 10 years.

0:17:38 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes, because sounds like ministry.

0:17:40 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah, it sounds like minute they all hate me today. God, you know, sounds like make my mantle bigger to prot Me, you know, from those fiery darts. But so Elijah’s mantle was growing and Elisha was getting more and more hunger. And, you know, there was a mantle starting on him. It was spiritual, but it wasn’t the big one. But so the Elijah was still growing and increasing and becoming more beautiful to God.

0:18:11 – (Kathy Gray): And then Elisha was learning and then what happened right towards the. The end when of Elijah’s life. Yes, I know. You got that there.

0:18:21 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes, we have it right here. We’re looking at Second Kings two, verse nine. Let’s see here. Let’s see. Let’s go up to eight actually. And Elijah took his mantle and rolled it up and struck the waters, and they divided this way and that, so that the two of them went over on dry ground. And when they had gone over, Elijah said to Elisha, and what shall I do for you before I am taken from you? And Elisha said, I pray you, let a double portion of your spirit be upon me.

0:18:59 – (Kathy Gray): Hallelujah.

0:19:00 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And then if you jump down, after he was taken, right here in verse 13, he took up the mantle Elijah that fell from him and went back and stood by the bank of the Jordan. And he took the mantle that fell from Elijah and struck the waters and said, where is the Lord, the God of Elijah? And when he had struck the waters, they parted this way and that. And Elisha went over, Hallelujah.

0:19:31 – (Kathy Gray): And there was. He got the whole mantle.

0:19:34 – (Heather Eschenbaum): That’s right.

0:19:35 – (Kathy Gray): Because you know, the mantle, when a godly person with a nice big mantle is taken up by the Lord, well then don’t you believe there isn’t, There is something there in the spirit realm.

0:19:48 – (Heather Eschenbaum): I do that.

0:19:49 – (Kathy Gray): Smart people.

0:19:50 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes. Grab hold of it.

0:19:51 – (Kathy Gray): Grab hold.

0:19:52 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Exactly.

0:19:53 – (Kathy Gray): And you know, the wise people though, and those who you know, say, I want the double portion. My God.

0:20:00 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Exactly.

0:20:01 – (Kathy Gray): And how wonderful. And I’ve seen that too.

0:20:04 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:20:04 – (Kathy Gray): It’s not just. I’ve seen people squander.

0:20:06 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right, right. Or even what people do is they take their grandma’s portion that’s of destruction or fear. Oh, my grandma was afraid. She’s passed. Now I feel it too. You need to be aware. You can take on other things, but you want the mantle from the Holy Spirit, from those people in your life. And realize, you know, as you watch someone and they have passed on.

0:20:33 – (Kathy Gray): Take the good, take the good.

0:20:35 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Take the good. Do not receive a pattern of family, familiar things. Take only the good.

0:20:43 – (Kathy Gray): Take only the good. That’s such good wisdom. I hope everyone was catching that, that wisdom. And one last thing about the mantle is pastors need to understand they’ve got to pass the mantle on. And yet when they’re passing it on to the God appointed people under their care as they’re passing it on to them, that their mantle is not decreasing.

0:21:11 – (Heather Eschenbaum): That’s right.

0:21:11 – (Kathy Gray): Their mantle keeps increasing as they give and pour out. And so it’s not. When you pass that mantle on, it’s not a diminishing of the old guy.

0:21:23 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right. It’s the truth.

0:21:25 – (Kathy Gray): It’s not a diminishing. And you know, people need to understand that too and have honor and respect for the more years you’re godly in God. That deserves respect. But these respected pastors and leaders have got to understand and not be stingy and say, I don’t want any of my people to learn how to flow in the spirit or you know, be this or that. Because that just defeats God’s calling for you.

0:21:54 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Exactly.

0:21:55 – (Kathy Gray): And on the people. And then he picks you up and there’s nothing for them to look to, to blossom and grow.

0:22:03 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Where’s your legacy?

0:22:04 – (Kathy Gray): Right.

0:22:05 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Where’s your heritage?

0:22:06 – (Kathy Gray): Yes.

0:22:06 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Where’s the double portion? And I’m so thankful too that that’s something you and Pastor Steve did not do. And I’ve watched you for 27 years.

0:22:16 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah.

0:22:16 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Where every time I, I’ve never seen a service where you didn’t pour out.

0:22:22 – (Kathy Gray): Yes.

0:22:23 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And they’ve always given and they’ve always said, I’m, I’m going to share. And I’ve heard you pray so many, dozens and dozens of times, I give you what I Have I give you what I’ve got.

0:22:36 – (Kathy Gray): Right.

0:22:36 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And when you’ve done that, whether I’m receiving it or someone else’s, I’ll watch Pastor Steven, Kathy do that from afar in the other part of the room. I’ll be like, over here, over here. Lord, I don’t have to have their hands on me to receive and expect and thank God that you both have done that. And if you’re a pastor or leader, don’t be afraid you’re going to ruin your ministry by not giving out and teaching and training.

0:23:06 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah. It’s such an important. We need to be Elijah’s.

0:23:10 – (Heather Eschenbaum): It is.

0:23:11 – (Kathy Gray): And pass that on and let it grow beautiful and big. And one other thing, as we close out this always on my heart, and I say it to people at our church, I say, I want you and I believe and expect for you in your life to be better than me.

0:23:27 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes, you do.

0:23:29 – (Kathy Gray): I say that you do. And I mean that.

0:23:31 – (Heather Eschenbaum): It’s the truth. Yes.

0:23:33 – (Kathy Gray): And you know, as I say that, I feel my mantle increase.

0:23:36 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:23:36 – (Kathy Gray): As theirs.

0:23:37 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Yes.

0:23:38 – (Kathy Gray): Is increasing.

0:23:39 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And people need that. And, you know, they look into your blue eyes.

0:23:43 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah.

0:23:43 – (Heather Eschenbaum): And they see the sincerity.

0:23:45 – (Kathy Gray): Right.

0:23:46 – (Heather Eschenbaum): You know, and that’s exactly. May we all be more sincere.

0:23:49 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah.

0:23:50 – (Heather Eschenbaum): May we be sincere with God. God. May we be sincere with our leaders. May we be sincere with one another. And may that sincerity grow our mantle as well. Because God only wants to do more. And even like you, you were saying, I don’t want to stop you at all, but, oh, this. Yes, yes, this. This is growth. This is mantle.

0:24:15 – (Kathy Gray): Yes.

0:24:15 – (Heather Eschenbaum): It is receiving. And you say, well, I’d love to sit down with Pastor Steve and Kathy and have lunch. Well, guess what? They couldn’t even begin to give you all of that that they can in this book. Yes.

0:24:25 – (Kathy Gray): Mighty Like Gideon. And just recently released.

0:24:31 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Right.

0:24:31 – (Kathy Gray): Yeah. By Chosen Baker Publishing House Books, and such an honor for Steve and our son-in-law J.D. King. And Steve also has another book that he wrote just to really pierce people called If You Only Knew: A Guide For The Clueless Generation, and everything that we’ve been talking about. So thank you so much, Heather.

0:24:56 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Thank you.

0:24:56 – (Kathy Gray): Thank you.

0:24:57 – (Heather Eschenbaum): Thanks for inviting me.

0:24:59 – (Kathy Gray): It’s really fun. And I want to thank you for joining us on More Faith, More Life. And you begin now to, if you’re a leader, pass that mantle on and grow yours bigger. And you who are in a corporate setting where that power and that anointing, the mantle of God is moving, come be involved and desire and hunger and be humble about it and get it. So, till next time, we hope you enjoy more faith and more life.